Comments on Is Larry Derfner representative of Jpost's values and views?TypePad2011-08-25T16:12:13ZDavid Bognerhttps://www.treppenwitz.com/tag:typepad.com,2003:https://www.treppenwitz.com/2011/08/is-larry-derfner-representative-of-jposts-values-and-views/comments/atom.xml/dcdoc commented on 'Is Larry Derfner representative of Jpost's values and views?'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef0153911655cf970b2011-08-28T23:19:17Z2011-08-28T23:19:17ZdcdocIt should also be noted that there is no group of Palestinians, at least not to dcdoc's knowledge, that limits...<p>It should also be noted that there is no group of Palestinians, at least not to <b>dcdoc</b>'s knowledge, that limits its attacks on Israelis to ones on those serving in the military and military targets. Those Palestinian groups that seek opportunities to carry out such attacks against Israel's military also seek opportunities to carry out murderous attacks on Israeli civilians, and they go more often for the latter than the former because the latter generally offer "softer" targets, that is easier to hit civilians and inflict greater numbers of casualties. The notion that among the Palestinians there are "freedom fighters" and there are "terrorists," those being different groups, which <b>Philo</b> and <b>Kurt</b> seem to believe in, is arrant nonsense. </p>
<p>Can <b>Philo</b> or <b>Kurt</b>, or anyone else, point to any Palestinian group that only targets the Israeli military and never targets civilians? If they can, they should come back and name for us those who might be seen as "freedom fighters" rather than "terrorists." </p>dcdoc commented on 'Is Larry Derfner representative of Jpost's values and views?'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef01539114b05c970b2011-08-28T18:50:21Z2011-08-28T18:50:21Zdcdoc"But there is a HUGE difference between attacking military personnel and bases and attacking civilians. While I'm horrified at any...<p>"<i>But there is a HUGE difference between attacking military personnel and bases and attacking civilians. While I'm horrified at any death of Jew at the hands of those who want to destroy us, I don't call it terrorism when it's soldiers.</i>"</p>
<p>"<i>While fighting against military target can be understood as resitance[sic], killing civilians at random, including even there own people is pure terror and can never be justified</i>."</p>
<p>Nazi soldiers fighting against Allied forces in North Africa and across Europe, and in the end on German soil, did so while in uniform; they had a formal chain of command; and most fought only against other combatants. So, arguably not "terrorists," though the Nazis did not scruple about killing civilians randomly or non-randomly. But that does not change the fact that they were fighting on behalf of consummate evil, that is the Nazi cause, as are those "resisting" on behalf of the Palestinians, even when targeting Israelis in uniform and Israeli military targets. Their "resistance" serves a hateful ends and stands in the way of a peaceful resolution of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, something that Derfner and his ilk, who romanticize "freedom fighters," especially ones who would kill Israelis, deny. So, it isn't a great deal less repugnant to say that what these Palestinian "freedom fighters" do is "justified" by the "Occupation," as some here seem to be intimating. (Do they think that the kidnapping of Gilad Shalit, who was "captured" while in uniform, was "justified"?) </p>Larry commented on 'Is Larry Derfner representative of Jpost's values and views?'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef015434d98dcc970c2011-08-26T18:49:03Z2011-08-26T18:49:03ZLarryI'm a bit left of center, but I must admit, it was a pretty shocking post on his part. It...<p>I'm a bit left of center, but I must admit, it was a pretty shocking post on his part. It can only be written by someone who has never experienced a death from terrorism in a friend's family or someone close. His belief that murder is the Palestinians' only recourse ignores the existence of passive peaceful resistance, Ghandi style.<br />
Very disappointing.<br />
Larry</p>Larry commented on 'Is Larry Derfner representative of Jpost's values and views?'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef015391060c16970b2011-08-26T18:49:03Z2011-08-26T18:49:03ZLarryI'm a bit left of center, but I must admit, it was a pretty shocking post on his part. It...<p>I'm a bit left of center, but I must admit, it was a pretty shocking post on his part. It can only be written by someone who has never experienced a death from terrorism in a friend's family or someone close. His belief that murder is the Palestinians' only recourse ignores the existence of passive peaceful resistance, Ghandi style.<br />
Very disappointing.<br />
Larry</p>Larry commented on 'Is Larry Derfner representative of Jpost's values and views?'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef014e8af9926f970d2011-08-26T18:49:03Z2011-08-26T18:49:03ZLarryI'm a bit left of center, but I must admit, it was a pretty shocking post on his part. It...<p>I'm a bit left of center, but I must admit, it was a pretty shocking post on his part. It can only be written by someone who has never experienced a death from terrorism in a friend's family or someone close. His belief that murder is the Palestinians' only recourse ignores the existence of passive peaceful resistance, Ghandi style.<br />
Very disappointing.<br />
Larry</p>Robert J. Avrech commented on 'Is Larry Derfner representative of Jpost's values and views?'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef0153910505a2970b2011-08-26T15:37:06Z2011-08-26T15:37:06ZRobert J. Avrechhttp://seraphicpress.comDavid: You are too easy on Derfner. He is a rodef.<p>David:</p>
<p>You are too easy on Derfner.</p>
<p>He is a rodef.</p>chaim j. commented on 'Is Larry Derfner representative of Jpost's values and views?'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef014e8af40939970d2011-08-26T01:14:08Z2011-08-26T01:14:08Zchaim j.I haven't read his blog post. He usually makes my nose flare when I read his hate filled rantings. Yet,...<p>I haven't read his blog post. He usually makes my nose flare when I read his hate filled rantings. Yet, I too, think you go to far. If it were an opinion piece in the Post it would be one thing, but in a personal blog it is yet another. What could be called for is scotch boycott type protest --- i.e. we won't read or buy any Post where he is printed. Thereby the market attacks him rather than government or other type sanction. It becomes a consequence rather than a punishment.</p>nanaloshen commented on 'Is Larry Derfner representative of Jpost's values and views?'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef015434d3b23b970c2011-08-26T00:14:12Z2011-08-26T00:14:12ZnanaloshenPerhaps Jews who feel they live in occupied land should move. There's plenty of room for them in Europe or...<p>Perhaps Jews who feel they live in occupied land should move. There's plenty of room for them in Europe or America. All Judea, Samaria, Gaza and Eretz Yisroel is Jewish, No more drawing lines to distinguish one part from another. </p>ED commented on 'Is Larry Derfner representative of Jpost's values and views?'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef015434d2944e970c2011-08-25T20:30:57Z2011-08-25T20:30:57ZEDI try not to read his garbage. He obviously wants to go back to the pre 1967 situation of apartheid,no...<p>I try not to read his garbage. He obviously wants to go back to the pre 1967 situation of apartheid,no Jews allowed in Jordan(including the West Bank)no Jews within the walls of Jerusalem.Would this lead to peace? I don`t think so. I wouldn`t make him a martyr,but shun him,what the English call," Sending him to Coventry". </p>Kurt commented on 'Is Larry Derfner representative of Jpost's values and views?'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef014e8af2635d970d2011-08-25T19:58:42Z2011-08-25T19:58:42ZKurtWhat Larry Derfner wrote is pretty sick. For me oit is hard to understand why Europeans can think this way,...<p>What Larry Derfner wrote is pretty sick. For me oit is hard to understand why Europeans can think this way, but someone living in Israel? This is completely irrational. While fighting against military target can be understood as resitance, killing civilians at random, including even there own people is pure terror and can never be justified. I'm agreeing with Philo and Chantal in that what he is writing is not fit for criminal charges. There are many things that makes Israel distinct and superior to any other country in the region, one of them is freedom of speech. He rather needs a shrinq. </p>
<p>Kurt.</p>Chantal commented on 'Is Larry Derfner representative of Jpost's values and views?'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef014e8af1d666970d2011-08-25T18:17:05Z2011-08-25T18:17:05ZChantalYikes! Larry Derfner is really out to lunch. Forget that, he's having a 12-course banquet on the graveyard of Israeli...<p>Yikes! Larry Derfner is really out to lunch. Forget that, he's having a 12-course banquet on the graveyard of Israeli terror victims. Ugh...</p>
<p>I agree with 95% of what you wrote, except for the part about him being arrested. Suspended, yes, fired, maybe, arrested, no. Not just because it comes uncomfortably close to government-sponsored censorship, but also because it would turn Larry Derfner into a political prisoner / martyr and give the article an international publicity boost. Better that it sinks into obscurity.</p>
<p>Then again, I'm sitting safely on this side of the Atlantic, so what do I know.</p>Philo commented on 'Is Larry Derfner representative of Jpost's values and views?'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef015390fddf8c970b2011-08-25T16:57:44Z2011-08-25T16:57:44ZPhilohttp://evolvingjew.wordpress.comDavid, While I'm just as outraged as you over Larry Derfner's column, I disagree with you when you write "I...<p>David,</p>
<p>While I'm just as outraged as you over Larry Derfner's column, I disagree with you when you write "I hope that the relevant authorities will see fit to file criminal charges against Mr. Derfner for his incitement." I don't believe that it rises to the level of incitement. Terrorists don't need permission from Jews. The incitement laws in Israel are implemented far too widely. Derfner's column should be categorized under free speech.</p>
<p>I'm pretty much on the left, and feel Israel should withdraw from Yehuda & Shomron. I even agree with Derfner that Palestinians have a right to resist. But there is a HUGE difference between attacking military personnel and bases and attacking civilians. While I'm horrified at any death of Jew at the hands of those who want to destroy us, I don't call it terrorism when it's soldiers. </p>
<p>But there is never any excuse, ever, to intentionally attack civilians. THAT is the definition of terror and anyone who engages in it loses any right to call themselves resistance fighters. They're murderers, pure & simple. Larry Derfner, by not understanding the distinction between these two vastly different types of attacks, loses all credibility on any moral issue.</p>