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Thursday, August 31, 2006
I'm just saying...
Someone I love like a sister emailed me last night to ask for some advice. I suspect she turned to me because I just happen to be the world authority on all things relating to Judaism and the Hebrew language (admittedly a heavy mantle to bear at times). I take these sort of requests seriously and hate the idea of letting her down, so I'll share my thoughts in hopes you'll help me out.
First the question.
Uh, actually, first a little back-story and then the question.
[Back-story: Over the past few years, this person has become quite active in a reform synagogue (ironically, the one in which I grew up). She and her family have been attending shabbat services and taking part in various activities and classes offered through the temple. One of the organized groups within the temple social structure is focused on the needs of 'gay and lesbian' members of the congregation]
OK, now the question:
"We're trying to come up with a name for our 'gay' group in our Congregation... currently it's called Kulanu. (which means ALL OF US)... none of us in the group are crazy about this name. It's not easy to say or remember.
Not sure we want "the Queer group" either. Is there a Hebrew word that you might suggest that would be more reflective of a gay/lesbian Jewish group?"
There are so many places my mind wanted to go with this that I spent almost 20 minutes just shooting down bad ideas. So here's what remains of my thoughts since receiving her email:
My first instinct was to ask myself why such a group even exists. If the reform movement has been welcoming to gays and lesbians (which, without question they have)... why mess with that. If one warm corner of a cold cruel world actually says, "Hey, you guys are our kind of people and we want to make you feel at home amongst us", why in the world would they want to create a distinct sub-group within the congregation to set themselves apart? After years of trying to be just like everyone else... why voluntarily hyphenate yourselves?
But on the heels of that thought I recalled my own reaction to some of the more shrill members of my old synagogue when I set about recreating the long-defunct 'Men's Club'. Several women expressed their opinion that such a group was anachronistic, exclusive and sexist... and that the very idea was contrary to the desire for unity we all professed as our goal.
But I answered that the same could be said about the 'Sisterhood' which, unlike the Men's Club, had never fallen dormant. I demanded to know why they didn't object to the existence of a group that by its very name was exclusive and sexist?
I suspect this comic opera of an argument has taken place in countless synagogues around the world... and that no two librettos will read exactly the same. But the way it went with us was that I assured the nay-sayers that as President of the Men's Club I would welcome with open arms (metaphorically speaking) any woman that wanted to pony up the required membership dues.
In the end there were no takers and the Men's Club remained an exclusively male bastion. But the fact that I had officially set aside the requirement for a 'Y' Chromosome somehow made everything OK.
However, the issue of a gay & lesbian group within an openly accepting religious environment seems to take the opposite tack. Instead of creating an exclusive group where others aren't welcome (I imagine that any congregant would be welcomed into the group regardless of his/her 'orientation'), they are making themselves a distinct and separate entity in one of the few places that has actively treated them 'just like everyone else'.
Before I go on I want to caution any of you who are already sharpening your mental pencils. I'm not interested in how anyone feels about gays or how you think any particular religious group should relate to gays. I don't use this space to comment on Jews who have made denominational choices that allow them to enjoy BLTs and lobster [~drool~]... and I'm certainly not going to allow anyone else to do so.
Everyone makes their own deals with G-d. Perhaps I'm simply not a very good negotiator. :-)
If you want to read an excellent (IMHO) and sensitive discussion of homosexuality and orthodoxy, go read what Mcaryeh has to say on the subject. However, today's post is not even tangentially related to that discussion.
What we are discussing here is why a group that has had very limited success in gaining unconditional acceptance and equality anywhere else in the world would turn around and deliberately set themselves apart from a community that has said quite unconditionally to them:
"Do not urge me to leave you, or to turn back and not follow you. For wherever you go, I will go; wherever you lodge, I will lodge; your people shall be my people, and your God my God."
(Ruth, Chapter 1- verse 16)
Anyway, that's where my mind went after reading her email... and I admit it is way beyond the scope of what I was asked. If you have ideas on the subject, feel free to share. Or... if you don't want to wade into such turbulent waters but have a name in mind that you think might be fitting for this group, that would also be a welcome contribution to the discussion.
For the record, I hated 'Kulanu'. It sounds like one of those tropical umbrella drinks. I was thinking more along the lines of either 'Keshet' (Rainbow) or 'Gesher' (Bridge). But then again, if they really want an easy-to remember name that is also in Hebrew... why not co-opt the accepted term already in use by the Israeli media?:
'Homo'im v'Lesbi'ot'
Don't thank me... I'm a giver. =;~>
The comment board is open.
Posted by David Bogner on August 31, 2006 | Permalink
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Comments
David, perhaps you leaped (incorrectly) to assume they want to separate themselves from the rest of the congregation. It's an organized group who wants to do some activities with the other members of the congregation and/or groups in the congregation, but also provide a social group amongst themselves.
Interesting that by forming a group that implies to you that we don't want to belong.
You're way off base and I love you like a brother, too!
Thanks for the actual answer to the question, by the way... :)
Posted by: val | Aug 31, 2006 1:44:19 PM
In response to Val - in that case maybe the group should be looking for a name that reflects the type of activities (or goals) they would like to offer / are seeking to share / would like to accomplish rather than a name that reflects who they are as a group. Just a thought ...
Posted by: EDW | Aug 31, 2006 2:04:15 PM
I thought Keshet immediately after reading the question. Glad to see that you found it, too.
Yehuda
Posted by: Yehuda Berlinger | Aug 31, 2006 2:08:07 PM
of course, as with everything else in judaism, the opening of the mens club had to have machlokes. why was i even surprised? especially with out shul...
yeah, keshet...
Posted by: Tonny | Aug 31, 2006 3:29:08 PM
In Washington, DC, the G&L congregation is Bet Mishpachah, which I believe is something like House of Family. And "Family" is a term often used in the community.
(I've been labeled "A friend of the family" by my friends who are in the family.)
Posted by: Nighthawk700 | Aug 31, 2006 3:58:52 PM
Thanks for the thoughful and helpful comments. I do like the term for rainbow: Keshet.
We'll have to see and I'll let you know how it turns out! :)
Posted by: val | Aug 31, 2006 4:09:53 PM
Hey Dave,
Have to admit, I have been following your posts pretty regularly. Good stuff.
Here is a link, a little off today's topic, but i think you will enjoy it, if you haven't already seen it.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-700910749701522890&q=brian+stewie&hl=en
Best wishes to Zehava and the kids.
Matt
Posted by: Matt | Aug 31, 2006 4:13:43 PM
The reasons are obvious to me why some gays and lesbians want their own synagogue. To understand this one must understand the gay and lesbian scene. Like the Jews they have been a down-trodden group for years. They have their own sense of ethnicity. When they form any groups, religious,scientific, social they feel comfortable as a formal group.
Why do some black engineers form black engineering societies or Sephardics for their own temples. Then their is the convenient social aspects. Many of these people also belong to more general association in addition to their special grouping. Gil Brenner
Posted by: Gil Brenner | Aug 31, 2006 4:23:29 PM
How 'bout "Heterogeneous Hebrew Homosexuals" which for the sake of brevity you could just call "3H"?
Posted by: Dcotor Bean | Aug 31, 2006 4:36:48 PM
Oh, and it goes without saying that this group should have a blog.
Posted by: Doctor Bean | Aug 31, 2006 4:37:55 PM
I don't think it's really any different from having a social group of knitters or teachers or singles, or whatever. It's not isolationism, it's just hanging out in a group of people with whom you have something specific in common.
I do take your point, tho. It seems a shame, at first glance. But as long as they don't remove themselves from the main congregation, I don't think it's urging anyone to leave them.
Posted by: Tanya | Aug 31, 2006 4:56:27 PM
Keshet? That's so... 80's.
Gesher too - in fact that's the name given to a lot of afterschool (babysitting) type programs around here- I'd hate for there to be any confusion.
Of course I can't think of anything better myself but Kulanu sure does make me think of Kaluah...
Posted by: Shifra | Aug 31, 2006 5:10:02 PM
I like your approach of allowing people to join whatever club, as long as they pony up the required registration dues. Removes the barriers of discrimination or isolation...
It's a bit like in college & university, people make student clubs there and no one calls it 'ghettoization,' it's just a way for people of similar bgs and interests to get to meet & spend time with each other, and hopefully do advocacy on their own behalf as well. As long as the people in the "gay club" don't start ignoring the straights in the congregation, I really don't see the problem.
Oh, and I think keshet is a pretty name. :)
Posted by: Chantyshira | Aug 31, 2006 5:11:36 PM
Val... I didn't jump to the conclusion that by forming the group they don't want to belong. Just the opposite. I would have thought that by belonging [to the congregation] the very idea of the smaller group would be unnecessary.
EDW... That opens up far too many bad jokes to even ponder. :-)
Yehuda... great minds think alike (but fools never differ)
Tonny... First of all, I feel the need to translate 'machlokes' for readers who may not speak yeshivish. It means argument/disagreement. That said, I don't think that was unique to our old shul. :-)
Nighthawk700... Great...just great. Now I have 'We are family... I go all my sisters with me...' running through my head. Nice work.
Val... Hey, chill out. You want to scare off all the left coast readers who haven't had their say yet??? Sit tight and let the people offer suggestions, mmkay?
Matt... How are you? Yeah, I've seen that clip. Every word is pure gold. Thanks.
Gil Brenner... Wow, all these years I knew you and I had no idea you were so steeped in gay culture. Go figure. :-) Seriously, I have to disagree with you on a few points. First of all, nobody said anything about them forming their own synagogue. This is just a social group within the reform temple. Second, while the example of Black engineers is excellent, I have to say you were way off base with the comparison to Sephardic synagogues. Sephardim and Ashkenazim (and many other smaller sub-sets of the Jewish community) have distinct synagogues because of their unique 'nusach' (text of the prayers), trope (cantillation) and other traditions that are a unique part of their heritage. To be clear, there are many synagogues with blended traditions and mixed memberships of Sephardic and Ashkenazic Jews. But they pay a price in lost traditions.
Doctor Bean... Or perhaps a numeric moniker: "Ah-five-six-seven-eight!" :-)
Tanya... The difference is that knitters have seldom been hounded, harassed or denied equal treatment under the law. Likewise, one's sexuality is quite different than a hobby. I'm just sayin'...
Shifra... There it is... Kahlua! i knew it reminded me of something vaguely tropical. :-)
Chantyshira... Yeah, but what about the underlying goals of the group. Take African Americans for example. they fought a long, hard battle for civil rights and equal opportunities. But the essence of their fight was to become completely integrated into society without regard to skin color. Yet I think few would argue that many black social and fraternal organizations have created a somewhat separatist climate rather than promoting the original goal of integration. I'd go so far as to say that there is more voluntary segregation today (on the part of African Americans) than was forced on them 20 - 30 years ago (immediately after the civil rights era). With the gay community there is the similar goal of acceptance and integration. The struggle to get the straight community to view SSM and two mommy/two daddy families as normal and healthy is not helped by fostering a separate identity in areas where such acceptance has already been granted. Just my humble opinion.
Posted by: treppenwitz | Aug 31, 2006 5:27:32 PM
Uh oh, looks like old Doc Bean has a doppleganger.
I remember a number of years ago in college when one group got the bright idea to call themselves "Separate But Equal" or SEQ for short.
In case you are wondering it was pronounced "Sick."
Posted by: Jack | Aug 31, 2006 6:01:36 PM
If I meant that it was a "hobby" I would have just said that. If they were forced into this group, your comment would make sense. As is, it's just condescending and snide.
Just as knitters wouldn't spend the whole time knitting, I doubt this group spends the entire time talking about sexuality and repression. Social groups are about making friends. It's always easier to make friends when you have a common bond.
And just as the entire congregation has no need to hear a 60-minute lecture on which kind of yarn is best for making socks, I doubt they'd want to hear a 60-minute discussion on which senator should be approached next about gay rights. So why not form a group of people who do want to hear it?
Posted by: Tanya | Aug 31, 2006 6:31:27 PM
Can someone translate the 'Lurch noise' into Hebrew?
(low rumble at back of throat, mouth closed)
Posted by: Scott | Aug 31, 2006 6:59:14 PM
I'm chilled... and completely enjoying this 'discussion'. Next time I have a question, instead of just e-mailing David, I'll just post it in the comments section and sit back, k?!
Anyway... Gil, I was also surprised at your knowledge of gay culture... must be that liberal town you're from!
Dr Bean... 3H? not to confuse with 4H, right? Cuz we don't even wanna THINK of anything with animals, k?!
keep those suggestions coming!
Posted by: val | Aug 31, 2006 7:04:05 PM
I'm not even Jewish so I don't know any Hebrew (although I always wanted to) What does the group focus on during meetings? Is it a support group? A social outing? If it is not actually closed to non-gays then remove that "barrier" and focus on the focus. If the focus is on dealing with society's treatment of those who are "different", then others in the congregation might also benefit and the name could reflect that. If it is for social reasons then look at that for a name. If the focus is truly just sexuality then maybe it's not an appropriate group.
Posted by: Jeannie | Aug 31, 2006 7:16:46 PM
David... yea, what are the underlying goals of the group? Your friend's email (at least the bit you posted) didn't say.
But if everyone prays and socializes together, then what's the problem with having an additional meeting before or after regular services for people who may have interests not represented in the mainstream community? It would be different if the gays/lesbians wanted to start their own shul, or pray at separate times - that would be segregation for sure. But if their group activities don't encroach on their time spent with the rest of the community, it can hardly be called segregation. No one even has to know who has what sexual orientation, depending on how they conduct the group.
On the other hand, if members start wearing rainbow-coloured tallit and kippot to services, then maybe they should tone it down a little.
p.s. - LOL at the 4H comment! No, no animals please...
Posted by: Chantyshira | Aug 31, 2006 8:52:19 PM
thanks for this blog...i too have had the feeling for years that the gay and lesbian community are like jews...chosen...and just outside the pale...but oh so special anyway...nice to see that the reform movement have given them a seat by the western wall...no i don't think they should call themselves the Kotel!!! but gesher is really nice...
Posted by: marallyn | Aug 31, 2006 8:56:21 PM
Chantyshira ... the group is social first and yet we're looking for projects to do on our own and joined with other group(s) in the Congregation. The name should represent the people in it - gay & lesbian. Obviously, if non gay/lesbian folks wanted to join our activities, that would be fine. But we're in the 'defining' stage of things as we're just forming and it's a small group at this point (about 20, but not all are active regularly, in attending events or offering input)
Posted by: val | Aug 31, 2006 9:29:39 PM
Jack... Nope, that's the reald deal. His IP address checks out.
Tanya... Whoa, I apoligise if that's the way you took it. Not at all my intention. I just made the leap from knitting to the more general heading of hobby. ANd of course you are correct about the shared interest aspect... but the question still remains of what exactly a special interest group has to do with the synagogue. My original premise was that there are so many places in the world where gays have to band together in order to simply survive, WHen a congregation offers them a non-judgmental place to come and pray just like everyone else... I still don't get why they would want to do something to set themselves apart, if only in name.
Scott... Your restraint is noted and will be rewarded with extra leeway on some future post. Thank you.
Val... Don't you have your own blog? :-)
Jeannie... I suppose those are good questions to ask, as I said earlier, I'm more interested in why the need to maintain a separate or hyphonated identity when the community has made no such disticntion (for a change).
Chantyshira... No problem... no problem at all. I think that part of my problem in understanding this issue is that in the Israel the synagogue is for praying. I've sort of forgotten that in the US it also fills a strong social niche and is almost community center for some.
Marallyn... You'll have a hard time convincing me about the chosen analogy... but I'll go along with beyond the pale and special. :-)
Val... Which brings me back to my original question: Why not join existing groups and blend in when given the rare opportunity to do so? I honestly have nothing against the G&L group. I just keep wondering why it is so important to retain the label in an environment where everyone is saying that it's enough that you're Jews.
Posted by: treppenwitz | Aug 31, 2006 10:45:21 PM
DAvid, Here in the SF Bay Area, our local Reform synagogue has a Lesbian/Gay group called KULANU. Our shul has a number of gay members, judging by the recent "weddings" and aufrufs for couples of the same sex. (We're a Conservative shul). The local Gay Jewish groups are very involved here in the whole battle for same sex civil marriage, a la San Francisco style. These groups aren't just subsets of the congregation as a whole, but do their own advocacy for issues that concern them in the wider community.It makes sense to pool resources. SF sent a delegation to the recent GAy Pride World march in Jerusalem. I know several folks in our JCRC who told me that they had planned to go - but this was before the Lebanon war.
For what it's worth, our shul's sisterhood disbanded years ago. Women are fully integrated into all aspects of synagogue life. So sisterhood is indeed an anachronism here.
Be well,
Helene
Posted by: Helene | Aug 31, 2006 10:50:01 PM
I do have my own blog, you're right. And this whole off shoot topic of Why the need for this group, will be a post on my blog coming to the Internet soon....
Posted by: val | Aug 31, 2006 11:16:00 PM
Interesting topic. I can see your point, David. In our shul, there are several smalller chaverim groups that have formed. Perhaps they can be their own chaverim.
I am just thrilled that homosexuals have a warm, welcoming place they can worship as Jews and be accepted.
Posted by: Stacey | Aug 31, 2006 11:40:12 PM
just a thought...how about kesher instead of gesher??? shabbat shalom
Posted by: marallyn | Sep 1, 2006 12:16:21 AM
In line with goyim, how about gayim?
Posted by: bernie | Sep 1, 2006 12:27:15 AM
You don't have to be a goy to be gay or gay to be a goy. ;)
Posted by: Jack | Sep 1, 2006 2:14:03 AM
OK, I'm probably totally wrong about this, but...
I think sometimes, even AS people are fighting to be accepted, a part of them does still continue to feel different in some way. Not in the sense that they don't want to be integrated into society, but that on SOME level they still cannont COMPLETELY relate to everyone else and there are issues they'd feel much closer relating to with people who are sharing the same exact type of identity. Just as women, who may be COMPLETELY integrated into society, still may want to have a girls' night, the gay community probably relates to each other on some extra level. Not that I know anything about it, just a hypothesis.
Posted by: Irina | Sep 1, 2006 3:35:39 AM
Irina, I don't think you're far off.
David, I think you've seen me write that my sexuality does NOT define my entire existence. I strive to be a well-rounded human judged on the merits of my total personhood. There will be always people who can't see past "LESBO!! EEK!", and that's fine.
But were I one of these folks in the synagogue, I think I would feel doubly welcomed by a group of gay Jews talking, studying, activist-ing, praying together. It would probably supplement and bolster my faith in my community AND my synogogue.
In my life, secular and lacking religion as it is, I can point to a (semi) parallel example. I have mostly straight friends. But occasionally, I throw a big party or organize an event to be with all my "family" and just enjoy their company. It doesn't detract from my straight friendships at all, but it does reaffirm (at least for me) that there is a small group of people out there who live and breathe the challenges we have as a group every day.
Posted by: Lachlan | Sep 1, 2006 6:35:44 AM
What is the Hebrew word for "embrace"? As in being embraced and welcomed, as well as welcoming new members into the group.
Posted by: dragonlady474 | Sep 1, 2006 7:08:58 AM
For what it is worth I think keshet is the way to go. It it what I thought as I was reading the post. Shabbat Shalom!
Posted by: Faye | Sep 1, 2006 8:29:04 AM
David, I think you let Tanya off the hook too easily regarding one point. Tanya's point about "which Senator to approach" for gay rights issues is exactly what brings up your question. If the GLBT community has achieved full acceptance, its partially because the responsibility of approchaing a Senator regarding gay rights is incumbent on all.
To put it another way, all questions of rights are really human rights questions.
Posted by: Jordan Hirsch | Sep 1, 2006 8:49:37 AM
To all those wondering exactly why such a group is needed... it hasn't anything to do with knitting.
- ever been one of the 3-and-a-half Orthodox Jews at a Jewish singles event?
I have. It's excruciating, embarrassing, demoralizing.
When most shuls are abuzz with the effort to create "continuity" - singles mixers and matchmaking-oriented activities - why is it so hard to figure out what this group is for?
Obviously the GLBTs will participate in the general congregation.
But even in an accepting community, the traits that distinguish these folks are still very much deal-breakers in most "get together" type shul activities. So there is obviously still a place/need for their own social venue.
Or maybe all you so-called liberals are too prudish to really consider things from that perspective?
Posted by: Ben-David | Sep 1, 2006 5:21:19 PM
Keshet is nice, and fairly easy to remember. If they would like something in Yiddish, the word 'gay' has long been translated directly into Yiddish as 'freilach'. How about the 'Simcha Club'--slightly misleading, but cute?
My experience has been that people involved in GLBT havurot and the like are normally involved with lots of other aspects of the shul's life, but there are some things that a specific gay group addresses, that others may not. Shidduchs often happen within the group, they organize all-shul events they want to see happen, it's just pleasant to socialize with people who can relate to certain areas in your life. It also provides a way to connect to the GLBT community as Jews.
Posted by: Balabusta in Blue Jeans | Sep 3, 2006 7:46:35 PM
Here in Israel there's Asiriyon haAcher - The Other 10%, which refers to the accepted statisic that 10% of any given population is homosexual.
They can call themselves The Other Minyan... or One in a Minyan.
Posted by: Pesky Settler | Sep 6, 2006 11:28:08 AM
I'd go with a play on gay and call it "The Happy Minyan", otherwise maybe "Kamochem"...and David, thank you for the link and support. I was a little surprised and disappointed that most of my regular Orthodox commenters avoided the post like the plague...
Posted by: mcaryeh | Sep 6, 2006 1:14:03 PM












