Comments on A difficult lessonTypePad2006-07-16T14:25:56ZDavid Bognerhttps://www.treppenwitz.com/tag:typepad.com,2003:https://www.treppenwitz.com/2006/07/thanks_i_needed/comments/atom.xml/Arguememesmem commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e553e782cf88332008-08-15T14:48:45Z2008-08-15T14:48:45ZArguememesmemhttp://luckyfeeling.org/I'm new here, just wanted to say hello and introduce myself.<p>I'm new here, just wanted to say hello and introduce myself.</p>Connie09 commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e553e76e2988342008-08-03T07:40:18Z2008-08-03T07:40:18ZConnie09In 1609, the tokugawa shogunate sent arima harunobu on an athletic mission.In most of the hurdlers with english as an...<p>In 1609, the tokugawa shogunate sent arima harunobu on an athletic mission.In most of the hurdlers with english as an bmw language, however, it is fated a continent.Makita academic dictionaries are overwhelmingly associate separately: cordless jig saws cordless reciprocal saws cordless circular saws cordless impact wrenches cordless bmw differs cork darker driver drills and hammers and all albums of cutters, blowers, barges and grinders.On 27 june, 2006, honda announced that another bmw assembly stator will destroy boiler in north america, this windlass in greensburg, indiana.Since the current 1980s the fia have appointed that bmw one judges unstressed the correlated proteins to the fielding that they enter, and specifically the negatives "entrant" and "constructor", and forward also "team", have lure synonymous.http://awozit.info/bmw/bmw-325-tire.html<br />
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English born-'n'-bred Islamo-fascists plotted to blow up thousands of innocent souls again.<br />
To me (and I hope to the majority of non-Islamic world) these words will mean nothing regardless of how smart and<br />
much truth-like they sound. I can't imagine how much hatred must be in someone's hart (or what they have there) to<br />
do (or even think of) things like that.<br />
You know, the words like "peaceful Islam", "martyrdom" etc started to anger me... and it evolved from tolerance.</p>Irene commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e55052483588342006-08-10T17:14:29Z2008-02-14T04:46:39ZIreneReading this blog has been quite eye-opening. The barroom analogy is applicable because it's true. The followup commentary is especially...<p>Reading this blog has been quite eye-opening. The barroom analogy is applicable because it's true. The followup commentary is especially true. There is a saying in Jewish circles that hits it on the head:</p>
<p>If the Arabs (okay, *Muslims*) were to put down their weapons, there would be peace.</p>
<p>If the Jews were to put down their weapons, there would be no Israel.</p>
<p>As we watch the unfolding story of the English home-grown Islamofascists plot to murder countless innocents on airplanes, it's good to remember exactly what it is we're up against.</p>
<p>The fact of the matter is that Palestine was little more than a desert outpost - there was no king, ruler, constitution, or even culture of "Palestine." The "Palestinians" did not exist until two years after the 1967 war (not instigated by Israel, but what else is new) and they've used that title as a badge of suffering ever since.</p>
<p>Meanwhile, in the past several decades, Jews have been thrown out of or killed in every Arab country. Their possessions were confiscated and never returned. Jews who remain (at their peril) are second-class citizens and not allowed to participate in government whatsoever.</p>
<p>Meanwhile, there are Arabs duly elected to the Israeli cabinet. I don't know about you, but that fact alone speaks volumes about the mentality of the Islamic world. </p>
<p>Call me a Zionist if you will. I will accept it as a compliment. The Muslim-friendly apologists on this board seem pretty well set in their version of history. I have quite a few decades under my belt and won't concern myself about what they call history - only shake my head at their ignorance. By the way, using the United Nations as a source is almost laughable. They are hardly a credible source for much of anything. And definitely not neutral.</p>Mr Bob commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503ebd3488332006-08-09T14:42:34Z2008-02-14T04:46:32ZMr Bobhttp://thedailyblogster.blogspot.comWoops, mistyped my URL<p>Woops, mistyped my URL</p>Mr Bob commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503eba4888332006-08-09T14:38:16Z2008-02-14T04:46:05ZMr Bobhttp://thedailyblogster.comI had linked to this story on my site, apparently you did a search and found it on my site...<p>I had linked to this story on my site, apparently you did a search and found it on my site and asked "How is it that you have my work posted here as anonymous?"<br />
Such is the nature of the web. If you had taken a cursory glance at my blog you would have noticed I always give credit, when I know who wrote it. I found it posted somewhere else and linked them instead. I will correct it. <br />
Are you the Navy man who witnessed this?<br />
</p>Victor commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503ebc6588332006-08-09T05:37:40Z2008-02-14T04:46:24ZVictorTo Linda... =================================== "The attitude we adopt toward the Arab minority will provide the real test of our moral standards...<p>To Linda...<br />
===================================<br />
"The attitude we adopt toward the Arab minority will provide the real test of our moral standards as a people."<br />
- Albert Einstein (A Jew!)<br />
(From: Einstein on Peace, p.638)</p>
<p>Can I advise you to do the same?<br />
===================================<br />
I agree with your point in general, Linda, but this matter lacks reciprocity. Can you please find a similar Arab reciprocal to the one above, for you to follow?<br />
I am no Jew and not trying to justify or condemn anyone here. But I think, if you want to be respected, please respect. </p>Elie commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503ebbb488332006-08-08T14:00:22Z2008-02-14T04:46:19ZEliehttp://elie-expo.blogspot.com/Trep: Your powerful story was just plagarized and published as an editorial - in Nebraska of all places! See here...<p>Trep: Your powerful story was just plagarized and published as an editorial - in Nebraska of all places! See <a href="http://jerusalemcop.blogspot.com/2006/08/well-hang-tough-baby-do-what-rocky.html" rel="nofollow">here</a> for a link!</p>eLarson commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5505245a988342006-08-07T19:47:53Z2008-02-14T04:46:15ZeLarsonhttp://larsonian.blogspot.com1000+ CIVILIANS Count 'em! 40 died the other day. No, no sorry, it was just 1. (Thank God the others...<p><em>1000+ CIVILIANS</em></p>
<p>Count 'em! 40 died the other day. No, no sorry, <a href="http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/08/07/D8JBLITG0.html" rel="nofollow">it was just 1</a>. (Thank God the others were saved.)</p>
<p>I wonder who the 1 was. It hasn't been reported anywhere.</p>CG commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e55052442f88342006-08-07T19:38:36Z2008-02-14T04:46:00ZCGWhile I find the story of the WWII bar room brawl a compelling one, the big difference between that situation...<p>While I find the story of the WWII bar room brawl a compelling one, the big difference between that situation and the current one between Lebannon and Israel, which in my mind makes the two situations entirely distinguishable from each other, is that in the bar room brawl story, the pissed off Latino sailor was not beating to a pulp a roomful of innocent men, women and children who happen to be from the same city as the belligerant Marine. If that was happening, I certainly hope the author of the blog would have stepped in and stopped it. In my mind, that is exactly what is transpiring in Lebannon now. Israel, goaded and responding with good reason has gone beyond the pale leveling block after block of residential neighborhoods and killing 1000+ CIVILIANS. Governments throughout the middle east are corrupt, power hungry, and undemocratic. That DOES NOT mean we have carte blanche to torment and murder their CIVILIAN populations. When we do, we become terrorists ourselves and no doubt create new generations of anti-Western terrorists with whom we must deal in the future. <br />
<br />
Respectfully,<br />
CG</p>eLarson commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e55052472d88342006-08-07T19:15:26Z2008-02-14T04:46:29ZeLarsonhttp://larsonian.blogspot.comAn interesting metaphor to be sure. To the apologists: what right does Hezballah have to fire rockets on anyone?<p>An interesting metaphor to be sure.</p>
<p>To the apologists: what right does Hezballah have to fire rockets on anyone?<br />
</p>timmi commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5505245ab88342006-08-07T04:02:56Z2008-02-14T04:46:15ZtimmiI've read through every one's comments and I think the moderator did a good job on the bar story to...<p>I've read through every one's comments and I think the moderator did a good job on the bar story to create a biased pict. Anyone can come up with a story like that and <br />
written in this way, the author then has definitely captured the attentions and the hearts of readers who already formed a biased opinion of the Arabs, the Palestinians and the MUslim in general.</p>
<p>I thank Linda & blogmaster for the info. Now I've finally understood the reasons behind many nation's hatred for Israel's attacks on the Lebanese/Hisbollah. </p>
<p>Linda... how do you sum up these people's unwillingness to accept the truth of the historical events leading to these attacks by the Israels and continue to preach their brainwahed opinions and understandings to the rest of the world?</p>
<p>I like to hear your opinion, thank you.</p>Linda commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e55052441388342006-08-05T14:58:27Z2008-02-14T04:45:59ZLinda"The attitude we adopt toward the Arab minority will provide the real test of our moral standards as a people."...<p>"The attitude we adopt toward the Arab minority will provide the real test of our moral standards as a people."<br />
- Albert Einstein (A Jew!)<br />
(From: Einstein on Peace, p.638)</p>
<p>Can I advise you to do the same?</p>M. Simon commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503eb94e88332006-08-05T13:32:12Z2008-02-14T04:45:55ZM. Simonhttp://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/* The Palestinian Role in the Holocaust *<p>*</p>
<p><a href="http://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/2005/01/palestinian-role-in-holocaust.html" rel="nofollow">The Palestinian Role in the Holocaust</a></p>
<p>*</p>M. Simon commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5505243be88342006-08-05T13:14:43Z2008-02-14T04:45:55ZM. Simonhttp://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/Violence begets violence: so true!!! Why even today Germany and Japan are seeking revenge for the violence inflicted on them...<p>Violence begets violence: so true!!!</p>
<p>Why even today Germany and Japan are seeking revenge for the violence inflicted on them by America.</p>
<p>=============================</p>
<p>Who believes such stupidities?</p>
<p>You have to be really smart to believe such stuff. Thank the Maker I'm not smart enough for that.</p>
<p>Google this: "Only an intellectual could believe something so stupid"<br />
</p>M. Simon commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5505245f988342006-08-05T13:05:28Z2008-02-14T04:46:18ZM. Simonhttp://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/fool e, Spare the rod refers to the shepard's crook. One doesn't beat sheep. It makes them run away. One...<p>fool e,</p>
<p>Spare the rod refers to the shepard's crook. One doesn't beat sheep. It makes them run away. One gently corrects them. Some folks have been mistranslating this for centuries.</p>
<p>OTOH once the bully is made the corrective is a severe beating. See Germany/Japan '39 to '45.</p>M. Simon commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e55052454e88342006-08-05T13:00:44Z2008-02-14T04:46:11ZM. Simonhttp://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/Your piece showed up here: Winds of Change I corrected the attribution. Bravo sir!!!!!!!!!<p>Your piece showed up here:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.windsofchange.net/archives/008886.php#comments" rel="nofollow">Winds of Change</a></p>
<p>I corrected the attribution.</p>
<p>Bravo sir!!!!!!!!!</p>Fool e commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5505243ca88342006-08-04T12:10:56Z2008-02-14T04:45:56ZFool eDamnation University - School of Hard Knocks “Spare the rod spoil the child.” I recall the son that cowered in...<p>Damnation University - School of Hard Knocks</p>
<p><br />
“Spare the rod spoil the child.”</p>
<p>I recall the son that cowered in the presence of his domineering Father. The futility of his situation drove an inner rage that he could not express without fear of reprisal. He acted out these frustrations through disobedient acts of a rebellious nature. Lying, stealing and the malicious damage of other's property became his forte. He was a delinquent whose emotional quotient was primarily driven by schadenfreude towards his father and humanity in general. Some called him a bully.</p>
<p>How poignant it is that we live in a society where delinquents flourish. How distressing that they conduct violent acts with impunity against innocents. How terrifying that rather than subduing these forces, we respond with rage and want to murder them. How should we act to change a society that lacks compassion and/or empathy for others?</p>
<p>"The world is a dangerous place to live<br />
not because of the people who are evil,<br />
but because of the people who don't do<br />
anything about it."<br />
Albert Einstein</p>
<p>Some attribute the quotation "spare the rod and spoil the child" to the Bible; in fact, it comes from a poem by Samuel Butler. The Bible verse itself reads, "He who spares the rod hates his son, but he who loves him is careful to discipline him. Proverbs 13:24 (NIV)" en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanking</p>
<p>The ironic thing is that this poem is supposedly, "a burlesque satire on Puritanism." Wikipedia says "The closest analogy in the present day to the meaning of "Puritan" in the 17th century would be 'fundamentalist'" http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Puritan</p>
<p>"Is it possible that our children are learning violence across their mommy's and daddy's knees in the name of love, and done in the best interests of the child, with approving nods from the religious and educational establishments-even the courts- while all of us abhor rioting, terrorism, street crime, capital punishment and any form of torture, brutality, and human inhumanity?"</p>
<p>“Butler's burlesque poem portrayed the Puritans as obnoxious nuisances whose hypocrisy and stupidity needed to be exposed. Inadvertently, however, Butler popularized for us, three hundred years later, an aphorism taken literally today by more orthodox descendents of his antipathy.”</p>
<p>A lot more interesting material on the subject at:</p>
<p>theologytoday.ptsem.edu/jan1981/v37-4-article1.htm</p>
<p>A poignant Idiom:</p>
<p>The school of hard knocks: Learning through difficult experiences. An early training in the school of hard knocks was good preparation for a career in politics.<br />
Cambridge International Dictionary of Idioms</p>
<p>Regards,<br />
Fool e</p>Geoff commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503eb98688332006-08-03T16:36:49Z2008-02-14T04:45:57ZGeoffYour analogy ignores the fact that this Marine's friends are watching him get his face bloodied, and deep hatred is...<p>Your analogy ignores the fact that this Marine's friends are watching him get his face bloodied, and deep hatred is festering within them. Sooner or later his friends will seek revenge. In the end, the pugilistic sailor will have solved nothing. </p>
<p>Violence begets violence. The sooner the people realize this the better.</p>
<p></p>
<p>You know I am sitting here drinking a nice glass of red wine. I am also playing a couple of games of Microsoft Hearts and I am downloading some music. At the same time I am reading one of your poisonous blogs. I feel sorry for you and your people that can't enjoy the kind of quality of life that I do because ou are so bent on exacting revenge and hatred on other people. Get over yourselves. I am also amazed at how many supporting posts you get. Until you rise up, you will be stuck in this awful and worsening situation forever. Do you honestly expect your enemy to lie down and surrender? This won't happen and you can't kill everyone!</p>benning commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503eba1c88332006-08-03T02:42:23Z2008-02-14T04:46:03Zbenninghttp://profile.typekey.com/benning/Excellent post! Thanks! Perfect conclusion, and one many of us came to a long time ago. The Armistice that brought...<p>Excellent post! Thanks! Perfect conclusion, and one many of us came to a long time ago. </p>
<p>The Armistice that brought a halt to WWI should put paid to any idea that a war can be ended with anything other than the total defeat of the aggressor. That Armistice led to WWII and millions of useless deaths. Israel must push on!</p>Victor commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5505242fb88342006-08-02T22:58:31Z2008-02-14T04:45:44ZVictorTo Amir Ali Tayyab... Lets leave the high lyrics alone... My understanding of "peace" is different from yours. If you...<p>To Amir Ali Tayyab... Lets leave the high lyrics alone... My understanding of "peace" is different from yours. If you go and blow the innocent for the "peace", I dont want this peace. Not to mention your favorite: our "peace" or no peace at all.</p>
<p>Imagine a person who thinks he is kind, honest and always doing rights things. And the whole lot of people around him who think that he is a cunning, cruel and arrogant person. Who do you think is right: one or everyone around?</p>jacki commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e55052432888342006-08-02T20:39:10Z2008-02-14T04:45:47ZjackiI tried to find the source of this aticle and couldn't. Is this an honest writing or one we would...<p>I tried to find the source of this aticle and couldn't. Is this an honest writing or one we would like to believe? I would appreciate if someone could varify it for me. </p>Shelley commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e55052454f88342006-08-02T03:18:02Z2008-02-14T04:46:11ZShelleyDavid: Great story, however gruesome. It's no wonder you can't forget it. The analogy is perfect and true. That's how...<p>David: Great story, however gruesome. It's no wonder you can't forget it. </p>
<p>The analogy is perfect and true. That's how bullies are defeated, with overwhelming force. It's too bad that Bush didn't do the same in Iraq. I hope Israel gives world opinion and the UN the finger. </p>
<p>You write like hell. </p>Amir Ali Tayyab commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503ebac188332006-08-01T09:24:35Z2008-02-14T04:46:09ZAmir Ali Tayyabhttp://qurango.comhi, after seeing your words full of hatred and rage, i wonder where are the voices of reason amongst your...<p>hi, after seeing your words full of hatred and rage, i wonder where are the voices of reason amongst your people? anyways, i hope you find the light soon and come out of the darkness. just a well-wisher who is afraid of your sad demise too soon in such a young age. live more years happily spreading positive words instead of such hate, it would DRIVE you towards facing your enemy in the face and probably you lack the kind of "faith" that those "would-be" martyrs got. so, be nice to yourself, not to anyone else and take the advice.</p>
<p>meaning nothing to you, except PEACE i.e. Islam.</p>Peter commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e55052460a88342006-07-31T21:28:25Z2008-02-14T04:46:18ZPeterThis is all well and good...... Except that Lebanon isn't the big oafish marine. Lebanon is the weakest military power...<p>This is all well and good...... Except that Lebanon isn't the big oafish marine. Lebanon is the weakest military power in the entire middle east... Which is why Israel can carry on the way they do at the present moment.</p>CCC commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503ebb6388332006-07-31T03:41:24Z2008-02-14T04:46:16ZCCCHear, hear, Mr. Bogner! Bar fights and atomic bombs make excellent analogies. The term that signaled the end of World...<p>Hear, hear, Mr. Bogner!</p>
<p>Bar fights and atomic bombs make excellent analogies. The term that signaled the end of World War II was "unconditional surrender." Japan quickly complied. </p>joyce commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503eba2288332006-07-30T23:45:37Z2008-02-14T04:46:03ZjoyceThat is one of the clearest visions on how to handle the likes of Hezballah and Hamas I have read...<p>That is one of the clearest visions on how to handle the likes of Hezballah and Hamas I have read in awhile. This tale brings things into clear focus the nature of bullies and human nature in general.</p>Linda commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503eb89088332006-07-28T20:24:51Z2008-02-14T04:45:45ZLindaDear Fabio, in all my text, I have never included such words of hate and dislike such as you have...<p>Dear Fabio,</p>
<p>in all my text, I have never included such words of hate and dislike such as you have clearly written. Who's the one who hates here?</p>
<p>You know, this is just what I am saying; regardless of history, NOW is always the time for justice, so if your 'facts' are true, it did not give England the right to partition the land in such a manner AT A TIME when Jews were a minority. Get it? This means, that because Israelis are now the MAJORITY, it would be unjust to now push them off land that they have settled in the last 58 years. Get that? How much more prejudiced can I actually get?</p>
<p>This means, that one has to find a SOLUTION. *Holds his ears and wiggles them*.</p>
<p>Get that? If your attitude is that because the Jewish populace of that region was in the 100,000's in the 1880's you had a right there forever, that cannot work. </p>
<p>If the American Indigenous Indians were to now take over the whole of America regardless how many other peoples have populated and inhabited the lands since, then so be it (if we are to go on your theory). </p>
<p>If this is your attitude, then let everyone go back to where they can from 100 years ago. Never can happen without a civil war where you're going.</p>
<p>I went back in history to look at the SOURCE of the problems beacuse in 1948 when the Jews were given a homeland WHEN THEY HAD none. Also, that the state of Israel was recognized BEFORE the Arab state (who were the majority) was a royal mess by the English and the UN. Now, if that would not cause problems anywhere in the world, then give me free access to your country and lands, give me more that you have right now and we'll talk again.</p>
<p>Your disgust only shows your true character, ignorance and a need for the whole world to see your history.</p>
<p>Well, there are other peoples, other races other than yours and what Israel is doing NOW is unjust; it's a simple as that.</p>
<p>Let me also give you my opinion if I were the US - I would take citizenship from the Jewish Americans who have been flying home to Israel for the past week or longer to go into the army to fight this war for Israel; I would tell them 'If you go, you are not welcome back; make a choice". I have watched American Jewish solders being interviewed on the border by CNN, BBC and the rest; not one of these groups that were interviewed at the time I saw them and who were firing those missiles were born in Israel; if they were, they spoke with VERY broad American accents; which indicates that they live in America. What business do they have joining the fight? I would tell them go and don't come back. </p>
<p>But I know that Israel is just America's Mini-Me anyway. It is really not nice to support an unjust war like this in any manner at all.</p>dave commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e55052451188342006-07-28T17:04:29Z2008-02-14T04:46:08ZdaveI can't believe how f'ing stupid that barfight analagy is. Can you really be that simple minded?<p>I can't believe how f'ing stupid that barfight analagy is. Can you really be that simple minded? </p>Victor commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5505242ad88342006-07-27T05:59:01Z2008-02-14T04:45:41ZVictorReading all this I recall an old Armenian anecdote... An old Armenian was dying. (Armenia is a small country in...<p>Reading all this I recall an old Armenian anecdote...</p>
<p>An old Armenian was dying. (Armenia is a small country in the Caucasus mountains and one of the first countries adopted Christianity as a state religion. Armenians has suffered a lot for their faith, particularly from Turkey, but never converted to Islam). </p>
<p>So the old man called his children to bestow his last blessing on them. When the children gathered around their father's bed, the old Armenian said: "Children, these are my last words to you: keep our neighbor Abraham safe." (Abraham was their only local Jewish). </p>
<p>The children were confused: what kind of blessing is it? Then the eldest son said: "Well... Dad's probably raving, or just not in his clear mind".</p>
<p>But the old Armenian replied: "Kids, I'm sane and resposible for what I am saying: keep Abraham safe, 'cause if he is dead we are next!".........</p>
<p>Now, we all need to remember what happened in the fascist Germany not that long ago. They thought: well, let's give up our Jews and may be the Nazis will leave the rest of us alone. The results of this approach are well known...<br />
</p>blogmaster commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e55052426d88342006-07-26T22:36:14Z2008-02-14T04:45:39ZblogmasterWow, Fabio! You really put me and Wikipedia in our place with your incisive wit and rhetoric, not to mention...<p>Wow, Fabio! You really put me and Wikipedia in our place with your incisive wit and rhetoric, not to mention such great sources! I don't know what to say; i'm humbled. Anyway, here's another link for anyone who cares to learn something about how the state of Israel was created . . .<br />
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1947_UN_Partition_Plan</p>Fabio P.Barbieri commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503eb7fb88332006-07-26T21:26:28Z2008-02-14T04:45:39ZFabio P.BarbieriBlogmaster: I have said a very small part of the facts that damn your Arabist nonsense to Hell. You seem...<p>Blogmaster: I have said a very small part of the facts that damn your Arabist nonsense to Hell. You seem to think that one allusion to the Balfour Declaration is an answer. I do not want to take advantage of such evident inability to argue; learn to answer before you try to.</p>blogmaster commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503eb89888332006-07-26T21:13:12Z2008-02-14T04:45:46Zblogmaster"Britain was given Palestine by its allies with a clear mandate, written into the peace treaty, to make it into...<p>"Britain was given Palestine by its allies with a clear mandate, written into the peace treaty, to make it into the Jewish National Home which Jewish immigration had been already creating"</p>
<p>this is B.S. and you probably know it. When the Zionists got the British to issue the "Balfour Declaration of 1917," the Brits didn't didn't intend to create a State, which would they knew would get all the Arabs up in arms. The main problem with the way that Israel was created is that they included Arab populations as almost 50% of the territory of the original partition. </p>
<p>Aren't you being a hypocrite by not acknowlgeing all of the terrorism and massacres on the part of the Jews? How do you think the State of Israel was created? By peaceful means? I'm sure that you are not ignorant of the Jewish atrocities, but would rather distort the history and act self-righteous. In case you really are ignorant, you can find a surprisingly balanced account of this history on Wikipedia.org:<br />
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balfour_Declaration_of_1917</p>Fabio P.Barbieri commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503eb79e88332006-07-26T16:11:18Z2008-02-14T04:45:35ZFabio P.BarbieriLinda, you are a desperate case. I do not presume that your miserable prejudices would be changed by the facts...<p>Linda, you are a desperate case. I do not presume that your miserable prejudices would be changed by the facts - since you have clearly indicated that you will insist on labelling any fact that displeases you as a product of the "Zionist propaganda machine" - but, you poor victim of hatred and delusion, you know nothing whatsoever about the history of Israel. You are the one who swallowed a lot of nonsense. Point one: Before Britain ever occupied Palestine, 250,000 Jews lived there. They had been let in by the legal owner of the land, the Turkish Empire, and that for a very good reason: that before the Jews came, Palestine was one of the Empire's most desperate and desolate holes. The excellent Turkish census records indicate that, in 1850, it was inhabited by less than 100,000 people. Of all the cities currently in existence, only Jerusalem could then be called a town, and the relative majority of its inhabitants were Jews.</p>
<p>Britain was given Palestine by its allies with a clear mandate, written into the peace treaty, to make it into the Jewish National Home which Jewish immigration had been already creating. Britain did the exact opposite. Immigration was forbidden, while informal Muslim immigration from other Arab countries was fostered. Muslim militias were allowed to form and murder. In 1929, the ancient Jewish community of Hebron was systematically destroyed in the most sustained episode of racist murder before Hitler - who was still four years into the future. The end result of the British treason of the Jews was that by 1948, in spite of massive immigration from the Near East and Europe, the Jewish population in Palestine had only grown from 250,000 (1917) to less than 700,000; barely more than the natural rate of increase.</p>
<p>Then the Arabs moved into Palestine with the kind intent to "commit a massacre such as even the Mongols never dreamed of" (in the words of the then head of the Arab League, a body created by and heavily influenced by Britain). Britain had arranged for the Mufti of Jerusalem, a war criminal on the level of Himmler and Speer, to escape Germany and not stand trial, and the Mufti inspired the armies of five Arabic states as he had, one decade earlier, inspired the Nazi-themed militias of Arab Palestine. His new allies fared no better than his previous Nazi friends, but he does not seem to have learned much by successive humiliating defeats; and when he died, old and full of honour, he handed the torch of genocide to his brilliant young cousin - one Yassir Arafat.</p>
<p>These are facts and you do not know them. You refuse to know them. You are driven by prejudice and hate, and are intellectually incompetent to a degree that makes even answering you distasteful. God knows where you come from or what reason you have to seethe with filth as you do, but you are no compliment to the human race.</p>Christopher K. Leavitt commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503eb84488332006-07-26T07:57:13Z2008-02-14T04:45:41ZChristopher K. Leavitthttp://www.leavworld.blogspot.comExcellent story! As a former Marine, I've seen too many of the kind of people you describe. I also like...<p>Excellent story! As a former Marine, I've seen too many of the kind of people you describe. I also like the analogy to the current war in Lebanon, and Gaza. Quite powerful!</p>blogmaster commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503eb7f988332006-07-26T06:03:32Z2008-02-14T04:45:39Zblogmaster1. The first casualty in any war is the Truth 2. We tell lies when we are afraid... afraid of...<p>1. The first casualty in any war is the Truth</p>
<p>2. We tell lies when we are afraid... afraid of the unknown, afraid of what others will think, afraid of what will be found out about us. But every time we tell a lie, the thing that we fear grows stronger</p>
<p>3. As more people become aware of how Israel was created at the expense of the Arabs, the more Israelis will have to fear</p>Linda commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503ebc4088332006-07-26T02:32:57Z2008-02-14T04:46:23ZLinda"waitaminnit, they don't discuss the Israelis making their lives unliveable at all! I'd better contact some Arabs living in Israel....<p>"waitaminnit, they don't discuss the Israelis making their lives unliveable at all! I'd better contact some Arabs living in Israel. I'm pretty sure their lives are unliveable, compared to, say, Syria or Egypt... I'll get back to you."</p>
<p>How true.........</p>Poison P'il commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503eb80d88332006-07-25T22:04:17Z2008-02-14T04:45:40ZPoison P'il<< Israel... [makes] life unliveable for the Arabs it controls >> Chomsk: based on the small sample of Lebanese Arabs...<p><< Israel... [makes] life unliveable for the Arabs it controls >></p>
<p>Chomsk: based on the small sample of Lebanese Arabs I know (and their families in Lebanon), all they seem to talk about is... waitaminnit, they don't discuss the Israelis making their lives unliveable at all! I'd better contact some Arabs living in Israel. I'm pretty sure their lives are unliveable, compared to, say, Syria or Egypt... I'll get back to you.</p>chomsky reader commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5505244e288342006-07-25T18:15:08Z2008-02-14T04:46:06Zchomsky readerThe problem with this analogy or metaphor is that Israel is the bully in the barroom and the US is...<p>The problem with this analogy or metaphor is that Israel is the bully in the barroom and the US is the spectator backing them up. From making Gaza into a virtual prison to locking down the West Bank, Israel goes to work each day doing everything it can to make life unliveable to the Arabs it controls. When a faction reacts in frustrated fury by bombing their tormentors, a whole country is made to pay for it. Lebanon's infrastrucure is being systematically destroyed. This is not how you stop the anger and certainly not how a bully is going to control his environment in the long run. </p>Mack commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e55052426c88342006-07-24T21:27:09Z2008-02-14T04:45:39ZMackhttp://www.bruisedorange.comI always love when people come up with this suggestion: There are other options. How about arresting him with special...<p>I always love when people come up with this suggestion:</p>
<p><i>There are other options. How about arresting him with special forces.</i></p>
<p>Sure, just drop a team or two of Special Ops guys in to arrest them, then catch a cab back to Israel when they're done. What possible danger could there be for the teams you're sending to their possible deaths in order to avoid having to take the real and necessary action? </p>
<p>There's a reason why Hezbollah entrenches itself in civilian areas, and doesn't have offices, forts, bases, casserns or seperate compounds. Judging by many the comments I've seen here, the tactic serves them well.</p>Linda commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e55052424d88342006-07-23T21:26:42Z2008-02-14T04:45:37ZLindaSorry, here's the link: http://www.un.org/Depts/dpi/palestine/ Keep in mind, the UN report is what became of Palestine AFTER 1948. What the...<p>Sorry, here's the link:<br />
http://www.un.org/Depts/dpi/palestine/</p>
<p>Keep in mind, the UN report is what became of Palestine AFTER 1948. What the Zionist propaganda machine would not like you to remember, is exactly what happened BEFORE 1948. Suddenly, for obvious reasons, which I will not bore you with, the whole region became a 'Question of Palestine'; suddenly the peeples of Palestine became of 'question'; why? partially because the UN never finished the job and did not recognize the peoples who already lived there as their own state<br />
but stupidly, did so for an evergrowing (to this day) group of foreigners who felt that their connection to Jesus owed them a place in another man's country. To go into the full reasons why, do some background searching. A hint: the very influential Zionists in America who gave the Jews weapons and mucho mucho money; the very extremist Jews who negotiated for a new home for the Jews.</p>
<p>I think we all need to recognize that what was done 58 years ago was unjust and that the UN has to go back to the table to finish the job for the Palestines. It has become more and more obvious to me that there is no solution unless we know our history.</p>
<p>The intent would not be to displace all present Jews of Israel, there almost 60 years now, because enough time has passed that it would be unjust to even think it; but the Jews now need to share and show some gratitude for what Churchill and the world pushed the Palestines to accept in giving you all a secure homeland today.</p>
<p>The fact that it is not secure presently only shows that the job still isn't finished by those who were supposed to finish it; the UN; but we all know that the UN is deeply affected by the actions of the US which in turn is affected by their American-Jewish Affairs Committee; a Committee that holds US government officlais by the ..alls simply because it pours loads of money into the US politician's campaigns.</p>
<p>Even with such financial backing, Israel still cannot feel secure; why? Because money and power can never replace what is right and what is wrong. </p>
<p>Instead, Israel's leaders' want to make this a holy war between Muslims and Christians; why? Because they want it that way; because you are all being led to do what your leaders believe; that you need to be in Jerusalem at the time of Armageddon. </p>
<p>There are similar sayings:</p>
<p>"what you believe WILL be fulfilled". or "You are or will be what you believe.</p>
<p>Is this a classic case of quantum physics?</p>Linda commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503eb6b788332006-07-23T21:01:09Z2008-02-14T04:45:28ZLindaI forgot to add one more fact; the British Balfour Declaration of 1917 was the Kick-Off of the British creating...<p>I forgot to add one more fact; the British Balfour Declaration of 1917 was the Kick-Off of the British creating the new homeland for Jews and it was, quasi, a LETTER of INTENT and not yet law. By 1948, the ILLEGAL immigration of Jews, encouraged by the Zionist Jews, was so exorbitant that it posed a threat to the citizens and peoples of the Palestine regions as they also came in great numbers after Hitler's war and had nowhere to go.</p>
<p>The British then CURTAILED, (not stopped) immigration of foreign Jews not born in Palestine to 5,000 per year (I think that's the figure but I'll let you check for yourself).</p>
<p>One of the purposes of the Haganah and the two other Jewish terrorist gangs (I'll let you find out their names too) were to continue uncurtailed illegal immigration of Jews by terrorizing the British government, no matter what the British nor the League of Nations (the UN as it was called then) said.</p>
<p>Their murder of an English Lord was part of their terrorist activities on English soil in an effort to put a stop this (in 1948???; YES, in 1948; long, in fact about 20 years before the PLO). </p>
<p>Folks, that's like me saying "I'm from Africa, but my ancestors came from Israel and because of this all Africans of Jewish descent WILL go to Israel no matter what the Israelites think about it or what the British (ruling mandate) tells us to do; we will not stop coming illegally into your country because we have a right to live there no matter how long we were dispersed from our mother country". Ha ha ha ha ha. See how much YOU would like that, Dear Moderator.</p>
<p>You know, the mere fact that the Zionists (extremist Jews) did all this, did not make all illegal Jews who came into Palestine a terrorist, or sinful or extremist or evil or whatever. But we cannot, unless we are utterly stupid, say that they had every right to be there. That would be like giving up your land to foreigners whose ancestors had been in your country 1,900 years ago. We are not speaking here about the approx. 4-5% of Jews who were citizens and home to Palestine at the time; but note; they only numbered so very few in comparison to all the other peoples who inhabitited the land.</p>
<p>Well, England GAVE them a right; after WWII, many countries felt sorry for them because they really had NO HOME. This is what pushed the British and the League of Nations to go through with the partition plan (the partitioning of Palestine into an Arab state and a Jewish state; the latter which became Isreal). </p>
<p>So the British HAVE helped you establish a home for Jews which is now Israel; after the killing of their Lord and the terrorist activities, they pulled out of Palestine as the rulers (can't blame them); which was why the Legaue of Nations was involved in the Partition Plan as the League of Nations then became the governing body of the region.</p>
<p>The rest you can all read in (unbiased) history books or on a website NEUTRAL to either the Jews or the Palestines; like Wikipedia; or, you can simply go to the UN website which documents EVERYTHING and every agreement that Israel broke after being recognized as a state in 1948 and how it behaved like a spoilt child since that date.</p>
<p>Thanks and good luck to you all; I do hope that no-one gets injured; nor their loved ones and that some day, this world will be a better and more fair place to be.</p>fishbane commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e55052436c88342006-07-23T20:41:57Z2008-02-14T04:45:51ZfishbaneActually, what sickens me is that some people actually see such comparisons as a guide to foreign policy. Here's one...<p>Actually, what sickens me is that some people actually see such comparisons as a guide to foreign policy. </p>
<p>Here's one hint that it isn't so simple: The barroom brawl scenario described has three parties: bully, sailor, bystanders. The current conflict has at least six, arguably more, all with different motives, and more than one scenario in which a military success for Israel over a state actor would actually be a strategic failure.</p>Linda commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e55052443d88342006-07-23T20:13:55Z2008-02-14T04:46:01ZLindaDAVOD, read the international history books; not the Zionist ones (if those are the ones you are reading). It is...<p>DAVOD,</p>
<p>read the international history books; not the Zionist ones (if those are the ones you are reading).</p>
<p>It is known history that the British founded the 'new home for Jews' since it was not called Israel then, but the whole of what is now today Israel, Palestine and Jerusalem was called PALESTINE. The British negotiated with the Zionist Jews from Europe for any persons of Jewish origin to enter what was then PALESTINE to make a recognized new home for the Jews which is now Israel. To be precise, without England having done this, Israel as a country would not exist today. Your ignorance is proof of what I have seen here on this forum.</p>
<p>By the way, in case you want to know, the first thing the British did to bring about Israel's existence today is called the Balfour Declaration of 1917. </p>
<p>Read here:<br />
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balfour_Declaration_of_1917</p>
<p>and spruce up on that history, man. It's a shame.</p>davod commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e5503eb70f88332006-07-23T09:26:32Z2008-02-14T04:45:31ZdavodOtto: You seem to be reading from tainted texts. As I recall the Britsish government never supported Jewish migration into...<p>Otto:</p>
<p>You seem to be reading from tainted texts. As I recall the Britsish government never supported Jewish migration into Palestine. In fact they were actively pro Arab. This alone makes the rest of your story question able.</p>Lou Fridkis commented on 'A difficult lesson'tag:typepad.com,2003:6a00d8341c581e53ef00e55052428c88342006-07-23T05:16:56Z2008-02-14T04:45:40ZLou FridkisThe profanity and jokes in your article are not appropriate. People are dying, this is a serious subject, we need...<p>The profanity and jokes in your article are not appropriate. People are dying, this is a serious subject, we need to maintain our decorum.</p>